Disclamer: My consligiare' Verb suggested I make clear that I am not saying ALL Black men are participants in the type of activity I am about to describe, nor that ALL Black men hate Black women, I hardly believe that this is the reality for the majority, but for a significant part of our group, significant enough that it warrents immediate and exact action. Basically, its not that "MOST" Black men hate our sisters, but far too many do.
One of my favorite bloggers (and possible cousin) Rosyln had mentioned in a discussion we had at the What About our Daughters blog, the frequency of "trains" or gang rapes that occur within the African American community. Rosyln had stated that these things occur more often than people would like to believe. Well, there was a time I would have thought that her position was an overstatement, however; with reports about things like Dunbar, the 11 year old girl in Milwaukee, and the recent attack and rape of a woman in Philadelphia I had to think about what Rosyln had said.
At the same time I was finally getting around to reading a book that my wife had given me a while ago, that being "Makes me Wanna Hollier" by Nathan McCall. I had just got to chapter 6 of his book "Trains" and was horrified at what I read. he talks about how he and his boys would run trains on 13 and 14 year old girls (amongst other things), and what shocked me most is how similar his story sounded to many stories guys told me of their "exploits" when I was a teenager.
There were many times guys would tell me about their participation in such events and I just would assume they were lying about a girl that wished they could get with. I am not so sure how many times they were actually lying now. The young ladies would deny it (who wouldn't) and the perps wouldn't give legal culpability admissions, just locker room talk.
What I do know is that when I was 13 myself, I hung out with some older teens (14-19), we had this little dance group. Anyway, there was a young lady who was like a groupie of sorts, followed us around. One day, the guys got her over to one of the members of our team's house when his parents were gone. Long story short, they decided to use her because she was "willing".
This girl was also 13 at the time, but it didn't matter to any of them. I arrived at the house expecting for one of our practices to take place, when I was told downstairs there was a girl who was available to "de-virginize" me. I get down there, and there is the last 2, literally in line (in front of her while she was being raped by the guy before them) to do what the other 8 members who were there were slapping hands about doing. I was horrified, I knew this girl from grade school, I knew she had a crush on one of the older guys particularly, she and I had talked about how she liked him, but everyone else she seemed to be allowed to do this to her because he had basically thrown her to the wolves after he had taken advantage of her (he was 19).
I'll never forget the look on her face, these guys believed she actually wanted to do this (maybe there are some women who would, but 17, 18 & 19 year old guys might want to find an actually "consenting" adult if this is what gives them thrills). In this case, this was a girl I had been in school with, who looked terrified and had a look in her eyes that she was complying out of fear. I expressed my displeasure at the situation.
Well due to a certain V.ery L.arge “Chicago urban youth group affiliation” I had (By nature as they looked out for me because I DJ'ed some of their sets), even at 13 I had a bit of an intimidation factor going as these guys never wanted my older friends and associates of this "V.ery L.arge" Chicago youth group to visit them, I was able to "persuade them" to discontinue what they were doing, so they allowed for the young lady get dressed. Then I walked her home.
She held her head down and said very little to me. All she said to me was a request that I promise not to tell anyone what happened, and I agreed. I said that what they did to her was wrong, and she said that it was her fault because she trusted the 19 year old and thought he liked her.
When I got back to the house, the guys were all bragging about what they had done, how much she “liked” it, the fact they thought they had "broke in a virgin", turned her out, etc., etc. I was cussed out by the 2 guys who didn't get their turn (they were both a year older than I and the youngest guys there besides me), and I was called sissy and "gay" by the older guys because I didn't take a turn. Some said I was "soft" or "catching feelings" for a "b----", and wasn't a real man, etc.
Honestly, I thought that was a rare event, when other guys said they had participated in this sort of thing, I thought they were just rehashing a story that they had heard, now I believe I may have been seriously wrong. Another thing came to mind as I read Nate's book. This happened to my mother when she was 17 about 6 months after I was born.
For those who don't know, my mother died at 42 from a disease cause by alcoholism. Don't get me wrong, my mother was a great mother, she sacrificed for me in ways I have just begun to appreciate, especially sine I have children of my own now, one of my regrets is that I didn't tell her how much I appreciated her more often. My mom's alcoholism was caused by her not being able to handle (or handling in the wrong way) many of the traumatic things that happened to her in her youth, and one of things happened to her on a visit to her father in Detroit.
My grand dad (whom I never met when I was old enough to remember) had married my grandma when she was 12, my grandma had my mother when she was 13, so she wasn't the best mother to my mom (not necessarily because of her age). Anyway, my grandma left my grand dad when she was in her 20's, she put my mom out when she had me, so my mom ended up living with my grand dad for a while.
She told me this story when I was 19. When she was in Detroit , my grand dad got mad at her for something and threw her and me (at 6 mos) out. It was late, past midnight. My mother was walking past what was known as a drug house run by gang members. Long story short some guys forced her into the house (one she knew from previous visits), put a gun to my 6 month old head and threatened to kill me if she didn't comply. She survived that situation, but was forever traumatized by it. There are too many issues there to talk about in one post, parental responsibility (and grand parental responsibility) being chief amongst those issue, however, I will focus on what my step dad had to say about it, that being "Your mom shouldn't had been up in Detroit anyway". I will always remember that.
Don't get me wrong, I love my dad (my step day is the dad who raised me), and overall I think he did a decent job as far as provision and some morality, however; I am thankful I didn't pick up his backward Mississippi (no offense meant to Mississippi people) Black man mentality towards women. He would always ask me how many girlfriends I had, and if I said 1, he said I should have 5 more. Amazing. This gets to my point.
Before I get to that point, I am not putting myself up their as a beacon of nobility, you see I have come to the understanding and am of a firm belief that any man is capable of raping a women under certain circumstances (it comes down to choice), this is predicated on my understanding that ANY human is capable of ANY thing. I come to this by understanding and taking a honest look at history, current society and myself. For the most part, from my observation, people are selfish and self centered, which breeds a lack of concern for others, which leads to all manner of evil, but that's a whole 'nother post. Basically, I think people choose to act "good" (or civil), for fear of consequence.
That being said, I believe that from my observations and experiences I might know a way that we can combat this sick mentality that seems prevalent in our community. I have come to an understanding that Generally, the garden variety sociopath or psychopath who is the ring leader of these "trains" or gang rapes is a lost cause from the jump, its the "go along to get along" brothers who are the greater problem and the problem we might be able to affect change in.
The garden variety sociopath or psychopath who is the ring leader wouldn't get far in these types of situations if someone, the average guy that is present had the moral center and basis to KNOW that women and girls are PERSON deserving of respect and dignity. Maybe they would stop it, talk the other brothers to their senses, or run like hell and call the police. I am talking to Black men, not because I think this sort of activity is exclusive to the "Black Community" (we know that woman hatred and rape goes beyond color or culture), but because our racial hang ups contribute towards the overall low attitude of Black women and girls in general.
Mr. McCall wrote in his book: “I realized that we thought we loved our sisters but that we actually hated them. We hated them because they were black and we were black, and on some level much deeper than we realized, we hated the hell out of ourselves”.
And I believe he is absolutely on point in that. Black men have got to stop hating Black women and stop teaching young black me to do the same. From that hate (predicated on self hate) comes lack of regard, honor or concern for women who share our color.
These crimes are not about sex, they are about power and abuse, a feeling of ownership over another human being, and a false twisted sociological mentality of what "manhood" is. Black men however, are not the only problem.
Black women enable this. Treating young black boys as princes and treating young black girls as paupers. Black women have an enmity towards black girls (especially when it comes to their sons) often raising their daughters to be subservient to men, teaching both their daughters and sons (by their actions most often) primarily that the worth of a Black girl is their hips, and whats between their legs. All that "man gonna be a man" and "girls are trying to catch you up" drivel just perpetuates this madness. There are actually WOMEN and GIRLS who set other women and girls up for these gang rapes.
Media is part of the problem, but the bigger problem starts in our neighborhoods, streets, families and living rooms. WHAT we teach.
Take church for example. Often girls are told to remain chaste, sometimes getting put out if they get pregnant; yet boys are also compelled to remain chaste ( they may get some lip service), but overall they get the implied wink from their elders that "boys will be boys".
That is the sort of schizophrenic teaching that has to stop. Also in the homes, Fathers often teach their daughters to be pure, but encourage their sons to lose their virginity as soon as possible, again schizophrenic.
In the streets guys respect each others mothers (and sometimes sisters, girlfriends, wives and daughters) but all other women (who are generally someone else's sister,other, daughter, girlfriend or wife) are b------ who don't deserve respect and are simply there to pleasure them. It all comes down to our community's collective socialization. It starts with each one of US.
I'm just saying...
Just found this blog from WAOD. Better late than never.
Thanks for being one of the very few men brave enough to discuss this hatred of Black women across the board. It makes you even MORE of a man in my opinion.
Posted by: Spinster | 03 January 2009 at 01:17 AM
This blog is just a summary of whats going on in england.I am an young teenagerI myself am a mixture of african indian and irish however i look like a black girl with indian /white features.
It has become so bad that black boys will say they do not even talk to black girls .This is very wrong. its not a problem liking cypriot girls or white girls or anything else. But to then say "black girls are dogs" They are truly forgetting there mothers are black there sisters are black they ARE BLACK .It gets worse.a boy has even called up a radio station and has complaned that he hates all black girls :| does he know every black girl?
he went on to say his sisters ugly what is wrong with these boys. a male firends screen name was "a mans best friend can never be a dog[black girl] i only do koli,and white " this is clear racism why do people except it .i have known a boy for about 6 mounths he actully talks to me and suprize suprize hes black. my turkish friend talked to him he was amazed she was turkish she then questioned him and he went on to say girls from your school are dark and large .this is not right.why do black people have such an issue with being dark or light this needs to stop.
Posted by: Lo | 15 January 2009 at 12:50 PM
I came across this channel and I thought I would share it with everyone on here. These are a 4 part series of why black men are dating other races from gurltalkktv by Temple Christian.
www.gurltalkktv.com
Posted by: Nancy | 14 February 2009 at 09:44 AM
Wow, what a post! I know this is old but hope you don't mind me linking to it in my next Roundup. This should be read by a lot of people.
Posted by: Neil | 14 February 2009 at 05:20 PM
Wow, DJ. I came here via Neil's blog. What a powerful testimony. This reminds me of the tales of guys from the football team and a single cheerleader. To me, it really doesn't matter if the girl is willing. That's a different problem. But the attitudes of the boys, if the tales are true, is simply unacceptable. I have never understood the double standard regarding sexuality, since my Bible shows no such thing.
From another angle, I just posted a piece on racism at my blog. What you describe sounds like racism directed at the self, or one's own race. And it seems more angry than what is now known as "white guilt". As one who is bored with the whole concept of racism, this type implied by your post seems the most pathetic and tragic. Self hate? This alters my perspective.
God Bless
Posted by: Marshall Art | 16 February 2009 at 02:08 PM
@Marshall
Self hate is the worst kind of racism, with African Americans it was first taught by the slave owners, the slaves replecated it and some of us just won't shake this.
Posted by: DJ Black Adam | 16 February 2009 at 02:55 PM
Thank you. This IS the most honest post I have ever read by a Man of colour. Generally the only Black male i have learned to trust is my bi-racial husband. I've stopped trusting Black men a long time ago and I started not caring about what happens with them because of my own past experiences with black men. I know it's wrong to generalize all black men, but as a Black woman ALL I saw were bad Black men including my own dad since he tried to molest me when I was a teenager. So the generalization was warranted at the time. since then I hadn't wanted to be around Black men or Black people at all. I often hated the fact that Black guys were raised as a prince in my home yet I was treated as the help by my own mother and because of this I never wanted wanted a son and God must have heard my prayers because I gave my sweet husband two beautiful daughters. We raised them to respect us and others and to respect themselves. So you can imagine my dismay when the eldest got pregnant out of wedlock and to a black man at that. To say I was pissed off is an understatement. She has since given birth to a little boy. I had assumed that I wouldn't love this child since I'm not fond of Black males but I love him to death which is exactly how I love my own daughters so at least that's a start in the right direction. So maybe with his birth and your blog I will earn to come to grips with my indifference toward Black men.
Posted by: Angelina | 07 May 2009 at 08:03 AM
I think where "Blamer" & A.M.S. might be coming from is the fact that you spoke to black mother several times. Many more times than you spoke to black fathers.
It comes off like you're very, very concerned about what these black mothers do or do not do. And you're concerned about the dads too, BUT LETS GET BACK TO MOM
It's uneven.
Even though I'm understanding that you mean to speak to both, you speak more to the moms w/o any context or reason as to WHY you're speaking much more so to them. Then, when you factor in that that many of those mothers were also the girls who've been victimized--it pushes all the wrong the buttons
Posted by: Roxie23 | 04 August 2009 at 10:41 PM
@Roxie:
First off thanks for commenting.
I'm sorry it seems that way to you, but I addressed Black Men, fathers, sons, etc, for more than 2/3rds of this piece, I addressed the Black Mothers afterward, as well I concluded in talking about the collective community.
As for why I addressed Black Mothers specifically, due to certain other sociological truths, more often then not, the actuality is that they are often the primary parenting force within our community which of course speaks to another problem.
A problem I addressed multiple times within my blog, so may I suggest looking at this writing in context with other ways I have addressed some of the problems present in parts of the African American Community to get a better picture of what I am saying, after all this is one entry of many regarding personal thoughts that I have had on a multitude of issues.
Yes I understand that some sisters were victims, BUT, as with MALE victims of child abuse, to continue the cycle cannot be excused because they were once victims, I expect ADULTS, male and female to look out for their children and want and strive for better.
Posted by: DJ Black Adam | 04 August 2009 at 10:55 PM
I am so scared and worried about this happening. It is happening all around us my male family members are molesters and rapists to girls as young as 8,10,11 and the girls are called fast asses and the boys that have been touched in my family are called puss***. They are not prosecuted and everyone is afraid to mention it. I do not bring my children around my own family because they ignore it. Having lost my virginity at 14 to rape I am terrified. I was villianized as a child because of it and kicked out too. I sleep on the street many nights. My mother often disappeared right before a molester would show up. What do I do to keep my children safe? I am married but dare not discuss this with my husband it is so shameful. My female cousins was just sexually assualted at 11 the purp ripped her panties off and yet she is called a tramp.
Posted by: Anonymous | 10 December 2009 at 12:00 AM
Thank you, thank you, thank you. I had given up on Black men, dismissed them as self-hating idiots. You just changed that. You have sense and you expressed yourself beautifully. Thank you brother, you just restored a little faith, some hope for Black men.
Posted by: Doya | 18 January 2010 at 05:37 AM